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Topic: He Has Expertise, But I'm Writing the Book, Advice
| Author | Message |
| advicesisterA | Posted – 2/20/2008 4:18:43 PM | show profile | email poster Someone has approached me about writing a book with him on a technical subject I know little about. He is obviously going to provide the actual information/content, but I am going to organize, format, and actually write the content. This person has never written a book alone or with someone else and has no idea "what's fair" in terms of an agreement for rights and compensation. In fact, he didn't even think we needed one, but I feel it would be uncomfortable and cause potential problems down the road not to have a written agreement. But my question is...is there any template or basics that I could use to fashion such a contract? What's fair in terms of a compensation split? 50/50? And, what about using the information elsewhere, or perhaps, who owns the content I write if he doesn't complete the book or wants to re-print it later? I am sure there are other items of importance I'm missing as well....can anyone point me in the right direction? |
| westsidestory | Posted – 2/20/2008 5:10:38 PM | show profile Definitely get a written agreement. Look around some other writing websites for templates for collaborations. These include language for things like ownership of the copyright, and split of royalites. But it's hard to give specific advice without more info. Key questions: 1. Does the book have a publisher yet, or is this a book to be written on spec? 2. will both of you own the copyright and be mentioned as authors? Or are you going to be "ghostwriting" for the specialist? 3. Will you be paid by the specialist for assisting with the book? Or are both you doing it for nothing, until you get an advance royalties deal? |
| advicesisterA | Posted – 2/20/2008 5:34:00 PM | show profile No, the book doesn't have a publisher yet. We are planning to self-publish it first and if it takes off, then either pitch it to publishers, or just keep publishing it ourselves. I am not ghostwriting the book. I will be listed as the author or "Author A" with Author "B". Neither of us are being paid to do this...if we do well we will make money, I am hoping. |
| stinking prague | Posted – 2/21/2008 4:11:07 AM | show profile you realize how much time and effort you will be putting into this? How much money are you hoping to earn. What kind of advances do books like this earn. What kind of research have you done on the subject? What publishers do you know of that do books like yours? In my life I have been offered 50-50 deals by so many clueless people who want to tell you what to write. Their 50% is knowledge equity yours is the sweat. And they will expect to be in charge. and will tell you countless times "I've changed my mind, I want it this way." If your prospective partner is so sure this project will be a money earner, then they should be willing to shell out in advance for your efforts. Its really a venture for them. your writerly butt will be on the line. They think writing is easy, they just don't know how to do it. Don't do it!!! |
| foodlit | Posted – 2/21/2008 10:24:36 AM | show profile I have to agree with Stinking Prague on this. You're the one who will be doing all the work. 50/50 doesn't sound at all fair. I also wouldn't self-publish this. Why not do a proposal and sample chapters and see if you can get a nice advance and sale to a regular publisher first? That way you have guaranteed money up front....before you even write the whole book...and that will compensate you for your time doing it. That is how most non-fiction books are sold...you have to demonstrate the need/demand for the information. Good luck, Pam |
| advicesisterA | Posted – 2/21/2008 11:39:22 AM | show profile | email poster I appreciate the advice, but I think I can stay in charge of this. The book is probably not going to make a lot of money, but I am also bartering services for some of my time, so it is a bit like getting money up front. I intend to do a proposal and a few samples chapters, maybe send it around as we are getting ready to self-publish. I am not going to be doing the selling and marketing, just the writing. As to the advance, I've published a few non fiction books already and I have never really gotten a huge advance. In fact, the publishers of this type of book will probably expect us to do most of the marketing and selling, anyway. The reason I thought of selling the book ourselves first, is that it is one way to show a publisher that the book is already a winner (assuming it is) and the person I'm working with claims he has a few thousand people who already want to buy it. If we do the work we get the money but if we go directly to a publisher and we aren't big names (we aren't) we are going to get a tiny advance, do all the work, and only make money for THEM. If no one does bite, at least we have the book and we can sell it on our own no matter what. Doesn't that make sense? By the way, the book is going to be fitness-oriented. |
| Stanley_Milgram | Posted – 2/21/2008 12:21:35 PM | show profile I co-wrote a self-help book with an expert. While it's true that the writer will end up doing most of the work, it's hard to come to any other kind of split besides 50-50, which is what we did. And yes, we did sign a very explicit contract spelling out the terms of our agreement. One thing you can take into account though is that if the book sells, it won't be you that has to go on a grueling book tour but the "expert." Basically, your work will end when the book is written. Since I had no desire to visit every Border's in the U.S. and answer the same questions on every A.M. Pittsburgh/Good Morning Ann Arbor kind of show this was OK with me. But if you really are going the self-publishing route, then I would agree with stinking prague. It ain't worth it. It sounds like you'd just be involved in somebody's vanity project and have little to show for it after months and even possibly years of labor. If you really think the person's idea is a good one and a saleable one, then I would suggest you do this. Make an agreement and spell out the terms. This includes not only a fee split but joint copyright ownership and what specifically each party is expected to contribute. The understanding should be that you would work together to write a book proposal. If the proposal lands you an agent and the agent lands you a sale, then great, you're off to the races. If not, then you've only invested a few weeks and maybe you've learned something that will do you some good the next time, as well. Any other route, I believe, will only lead to misery and recrimination. |
| foodlit | Posted – 2/21/2008 1:05:38 PM | show profile Well you seem to have it all figured out. Maybe you'll be an exception to the rule, but self-publishing is a very hard road to go...especially if you have no interest in marketing the book. They don't sell themselves...and I would be skeptical of this guys claim that he has a few thousand people lined up to buy it...if that is really true then you should easily be able to get a good deal from a publisher, and the main reason you would do that is because they will handle the sales and distribution for you. Good luck. |
| advicesisterA | Posted – 2/21/2008 2:13:46 PM | show profile | email poster again, thanks for your input. I am now more strongly considering putting together a proposal and a few sample chapters to send around...but my expert hasn't a clue how to do this so it's extra work for me. It is true that I won't have to go on a book tour and promote the book after it's done if we go the traditional route, but finding an agent or a publisher and doing the up front proposal and pitching isn't a walk in the park, either--and I am going to have to take the lead on this part and I'm not eager to do it. The book will be mainly photos with limited text. I figure my job is more dragging the co-author through the steps necessary to create and publish the book...and providing what amounts to detailed captions for photos and some up-front chapter information. I doubt the writing will be much effort, but the organization and working with a newbie, will be a struggle. And, my expert has very firm ideas about what he wants to do and appears fairly inflexible with his vision....a publisher is going to want him to compromise and he doesn't want to do that. So self-publishing lets us do it his way (first, at least). My feeling is that every dime that is profit goes to US and not to a publisher, who isn't going to give us much in terms of an advance or royalties. I hate to sound negative but if you're not a "Dr. Phil" they're not going to jump on your self-help book and give you wads of money for it. I think that's just the reality. I want to help out this person and I am hoping I will make a few dollars, but I'm not going to fund my retirement with it, most likely. Self help books about fitness don't flood the best seller lists, do they? |
| foodlit | Posted – 2/21/2008 2:42:33 PM | show profile Yes, they do actually. Self-help and fitness are two of the bigger categories in non-fiction. Hugely profitable. Non-fiction is a much bigger market than fiction. Remember, when it comes to sales, 100% of nothing or low sales, doesn't mean more than a smaller percentage of the sales a big publisher could generate. The advance you'd be likely to get from a real publisher would probably be more money than you'd make if you self-pubbed! There's lots of info on line on how to do a book proposal and if you search on amazon, there are two books you can guy together for around $20 total that complement each other and tell you exactly how to do it...one is full of examples the other is better on explaining the sections, so together you'll be all set. |
| advicesisterA | Posted – 2/21/2008 7:01:26 PM | show profile Thanks for the positive energy. I've done about 20 book proposals, although not all turned into sales. So I know what's involved. But there is a lot of paperwork and planning, and a literature review, and a market analylsis, and so forth and my expert isn't going to know how to do it or want to do it. And I certainly do not want to! I just wanted to help him out with the actual writing of the book. And, despite claims that self-help and fitness are popular, there is a lot of competition in the self-help market. I know, because that's my expertise and my genre. So I am still not convinced that self-publishing a book is less lucrative than having to craft a proposal, seek out the right places to send it, make tons of copies (and this book also has to rely on lots of expensive photos that would have to be included in the proposal) and then wait to see if anyone wants another fitness book in a competitive market. If my expert has enough people willing to buy his book (and he says he does) then I'll make enough money to justify the time and effort I have to put in. But if I wait for a publisher to pick it up and it isn't picked up, I have absolutely nothing? |
| foodlit | Posted – 2/21/2008 7:52:39 PM | show profile None of it sounds easy to me. :) Good luck with whatever you decide. |
